"I was convinced I could save my brother": Loving through recovery and relapse (with Azlyn Belisle)
About the episode
At 16, Azlyn was trying to figure out high school and who she wanted to become. Instead, she found herself trying to save her brother from addiction—covering for him, protecting him from consequences, and carrying a responsibility that was never hers to hold. Then came recovery. Then relapse. Then recovery again.
For siblings of someone with addiction, there’s no handbook. How do you support a sibling without enabling them? How do you set boundaries when you’re terrified something will happen to them? And how do you keep living your own life when part of you is always thinking about theirs?
In this episode, Azlyn opens up about growing up alongside her brother’s addiction, the guilt and responsibility she carried, and learning how to support him without losing herself.
If you’re a sibling of someone struggling with addiction, this episode is for you. Because you can love someone deeply and support their recovery without being responsible for saving them.
Guest: Azlyn Belisle, younger sibling to a brother in recovery
This episode will help you
Understand how addiction can affect siblings and the entire family—not just the person using substances
Recognize when love and support can start to feel like responsibility for someone else’s recovery
Understand the complicated emotions siblings may experience around recovery and relapse
Think differently about boundaries, enabling, and allowing a loved one to face the consequences of their choices
Remember that you can support someone with addiction without putting your own life and well-being on hold
Find hope while accepting that recovery—and your relationship with your sibling—may not be linear
Resources
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Azlyn: [00:00:00] I didn't wanna be seen as the bad guy I wanted to be seen as reliable to him because I didn't wanna fail him.
Azlyn: A lot of people would say "Azlyn, how can your life be falling apart?" But I didn't wanna let people on to, what was happening.
Azlyn: I genuinely did think I was gonna not only save him, but save our family.
Dominique: Welcome to FLOR for Love of Recovery, where I'm your host, Dominique Dajer. Sibling relationships can be so unique, but they can become more complex when there's drug or alcohol use involved. If you find yourself questioning how to help, you're not alone.
Dominique: Join me on this journey in restoring hope and healing.
Dominique: A lot of the guests that we have on For Love of Recovery are professionals in the addiction and recovery space, or families who have a loved one in recovery or who've actually lost a family member to addiction. Today, we have a very different guest with us. Azlyn Belisle is navigating her brother's addiction, his recovery, and relapse in real time.
Dominique: She was just [00:01:00] 16 when her brother started struggling with substance use, and today As and I are gonna talk about what no one tells siblings when they're loving someone through addiction. Aslyn, thank you so much for being on the show today. I really appreciate you taking the time to be here and to be vulnerable and be in this space with us.
Azlyn: Yes. Thank you so much for having me. i'm excited
Dominique: I would love it if you could take a minute or so to take us back to what your relationship was like with your brother before his substance use escalated.
Azlyn: Yes. So my brother's name is Andrew. and he and I were adopted, at a very young age from across the world, and so we've been very close, since then. whatever he did, I felt the need I had to do because, you know, he was like my role model and it was always cool to like do what he was doing. and so we had a, we had a great relationship as a kid. I mean, obviously, like you have your sibling fights, but nothing like out of the ordinary. And so then,, I was 16 years old when he started struggling with addiction. And at first it wasn't like that big of a deal because I didn't really know what he was [00:02:00] doing.
Azlyn: Like I had heard he'd been out
Dominique: Mm-hmm.
Azlyn: he didn't like do anything like in a way, I guess. So I kind of just ignored it.
Dominique: When did you realize there was something strange or something different going on with Andrew?
Azlyn: Yeah, so he essentially A senior in high school during 2020 which is when this all started during the pandemic. So he threw himself a little graduation party, for the lack of better words, at my grandma's house. so he was drinking and hanging out with friends, as one does, and the neighbor actually brought him home, which I thought was really strange, but I didn't really care, honestly.
Azlyn: Like, they were like, "Oh, yeah, he was drinking and he wanted to drive home," but I was like, "Okay, like everybody makes a mistake." Like, I didn't look that much into it. I didn't even say anything to him. I just swept it under the rug. But as time went on, it snowballed and snowballed, and so I started to like kind of catch him doing other things.
Azlyn: So it wasn't just drinking. Eventually, it was like selling vapes or going to a parking garage and like doing drugs. But again, like he'd come home and things were fine, so I was just like, "Look, [00:03:00] like I wasn't there. I'm not here to like judge you."
Dominique: Yeah. There's this, innocence around, what's actually going on or how you should handle it, especially if he's older and you're a little bit younger. Looking back in retrospect, what did you wish you knew or what did you wish someone had told you when you were about 16 about how addiction works or how it affects the family in the long run?
Azlyn: So to be honest with you I didn't know he had an addiction. it's funny, but I kind of attributed it to, like, soda. Like, everybody, like, there's some people that just, like, love drinking soda, right? Obviously alcohol is different, but again, like, he wasn't, like, doing anything, like, destructive in a way.
Azlyn: So I was just like, "Okay, like, he's drinking and he probably... I mean, he shouldn't be doing that." But a lot of the times he was drinking at home, again, it wasn't like he was out driving, beating people up, doing, like, crazy things. Like, he was just getting, I wouldn't even say drunk. He was getting tipsy at home. And honestly, it made him really funny, so I kind of played along with it, too. Like, he would just, like, do funny things. And it wasn't until [00:04:00] I would say maybe a year or so later that I was like, "Okay, buddy, like, you have an issue
Dominique: It's hard because you don't always realize it in the moment. So, like, as things started to get more intense you know, as you got older, what did your relationship look like?
Azlyn: I was his younger sister, but I also felt like I
Dominique: Mm-hmm.
Azlyn: in a way to kinda just, like, be there for him.
Azlyn: So I would drive him around, he'd go buy vapes off of a friend, and then we'd go sell them. Well, he would sell them, and I would just kind of, like, chauffeur him around. I was making money off of this, so as a 16-year-old I was
Azlyn: like, I thought it was great. Eventually, like, I started saying, like, "Do you think selling vapes is a good idea?" But again, like, I wasn't here to fight with him
Dominique: when did you realize, like, there was, some kind of problem with what was going on?
Azlyn: Yes. I don't even wanna say I was like oblivious, but the idea of him being an actual, like, alcoholic never crossed my mind for like the longest time. I just thought he was like struggling and he wanted to fit in and the friends he [00:05:00] was around, they were doing the same thing.
Azlyn: So I thought like, this is what you do when you get older. I don't really like to use the word enabling. Some people would say I was enbling his behavior by what I was doing, but as things ramped up he was getting violent. And so I would like sneak him into the house, I would cover up for him, I'd basically hide what he was doing from my parents because I want to be the reason that like the family fell apart, right? And so that kind of like ties into out adoption, but I've always felt like I've owed something to my parents. And so I thought that if I this boy out to them, that it's gonna destroy everything, and I didn't wanna be the person to do that. I didn't wanna be seen as the bad guy I wanted to be seen as like reliable to him because he and I had a very great relationship and I didn't wanna like fail him in a way. Unfortunately, it got to a point where he did start getting violent with people, and that's when I was like, "Andrew, like you might have an issue and we need to get this figured out.
Dominique: Yeah, it's complicated because one thing that you're talking about too is, [00:06:00] your dynamic with your family and your parents and, like, wanting to make sure that, you know, you're not causing problems and that you're trying to, like, for lack of a better comparison, like, almost, like, keep the peace. But you're also realizing, like, what's going on with Andrew, and you don't wanna turn a blind eye to it.
Dominique: So it kind of puts you in, like, a tough spot between, like, your parents and your brother.
Azlyn: Yeah, so we also have a younger sister. So I'm the middle, he's the oldest, and I would always cover up for them. Like, he would do something stupid but I'd be like, "Oh yeah, that was me," 'cause I didn't wanna see him get in trouble, and the same with my sister.
Azlyn: That's just, like, how I've been my whole life. I just always wanna, keep the peace. It made it hard because like I said, I didn't really say anything to my parents. My dad would get really upset with him, and I would just tell my dad, like, "Dad, just, like, let it go.
Azlyn: He's gonna have to learn, A, and B, like, he's drunk. You're really not gonna get through to him right now if you just continue to hammer him." the same time, though, I would have conversations with Andrew, like, "Something needs to change because, like, you're going down a very scary route
Dominique: It's a lot to, like, be [00:07:00] able to notice all of those different signs and also have those conversations with your parents and feeling like you're being caught in the middle. Do you feel like you were always the sibling that had it all together? And, like, why do you feel like it was your job to, you know, protect Andrew or to try to, like, moderate that dynamic between him and your parents or even, like, your younger sister?
Azlyn: Yeah a lot of people would say even today, like, I have it all together. Like, "Azlyn, how can your life be falling apart?" But I didn't wanna let people on to, like, what was happening.
Azlyn: So to everybody, like, things were great, right? It wasn't untilmy sister was home with my parents and Andrew. And she called me, She was like, "Andrew's acting out again." And I was like, "Well, what do you mean?" 'Cause it could mean a b-- bunch of different things, right? And she was like, "I don't know. He's just fighting with our grandparents and Dad." So I called my dad, and I was like, "Do you want me to come home and, like, take care of Andrew?" Because right before that, like, I had built enough of a relationship with him where, like, he would kind of open [00:08:00] up to me, and I'd, 'cause I would say like, "Andrew, like, why are we doing this again?
Azlyn: Like, what is going on in your life that you feel the need to do this?" And so my dad was like, "No, like I think I have it under control." And I said, "Okay." Well then that day it's a day that I will never forget. I was driving home with a friend 'cause I had just gotten my license, and where we live it's, like, right at the end of a street, so when you're coming down the street you can see my house. Saw the police lights, and I was like, "There's no way they're at my house again." Because unfortunately I used to say that Andrew was a magnet for the lights. Just like wherever he was, they were, which was very unfortunate. And again, it was like something I was hiding from, so much of my life. So now I have my friend in my car, and we see the lights at my house, and she's like, "What's going on?" And I was like, "I don't know. My mom probably, like, popped another tire or something." I made something up. It was, like, my way to hide it. So I dropped her off at her house, and I went home. And went in the house, and my brother was very upset with my parents, and I said to him like, "Andrew, like what [00:09:00] is going on?" And long story short, he and my dad had just gotten into a fight 'cause he was found drinking again. And so I kinda just was like, "Okay, like- I just kinda like let it go, to be honest with you. Later that day though, another police had come back and Andrew left the house. He went fishing with my grandpa, because one thing about Andrew is, like, he loved fishing. And so, you know, during this whole thing, like I'd make these little, like deals with him. Like, if you don't drink for X amount of days, we can go fishing. hate fishing. I think it is Like I, I don't get the concept of like putting a worm on the hook and then getting the fish. I don't do all that. But I would do it for him. So he left, and that's when I was like, I said to my parents, like, "Something needs to change because obviously, like he needs help
Dominique: It's a lot of pressure and a lot of stress to put on a young adult, someone who's figuring out themselves, but also trying to, like, save their brother and figuring out, like, what the extent of his addiction is. [00:10:00] And also, it sounds like you probably were trying to protect Andrew from the consequences of maybe what have been, might have been going on with, like, your parents or, you know, trying to cover up for the challenges that were coming up, like, with, like, the police, and that's a lot to put on a young adult.
Dominique: What did saving your brother look like? Did you think that you were able to protect him from consequences? Did you think that the power of your relationship would help him see what he was doing and make a change on his own? What was the end result that you were hoping to get from it?
Azlyn: I did, yeah. I genuinely did think I was gonna not only save him, but save our family, because unfortunately our family just started falling apart. It was an almost everyday occurrence of having the cops back at my house because he's drunk, and now he's like, you know, acting out in a way.
Azlyn: There was, like, this one instance, but he got into a very bad situation, and it could have costed him his life. And I thought that would be his [00:11:00] rock bottom, 'cause everybody was like, "You gotta let him hit rock bottom.
Azlyn: You can't save him. He's gotta save himself." And I was like, "No, like, I'm gonna save him. Like, I don't really know what it's gonna take, but I'm gonna save him." So he got into this situation, and it was really upsetting because, he had totaled another car in this situation, and I had to bring him to the car to get his belongings. Essentially, he had gotten very injured, and so he couldn't drive, obviously. And so we went to the car, and he had told me he had only had two drinks that night. He had more, and there was evidence. And I looked at him that day on the side of the road where his car was, and I said, "Something needs to change immediately because you're not continue to live like this." And he was like, "Let me go. Like, I'm fine. I don't have an issue." And I said, "Okay." And so then for a little bit, like, we didn't have a super close relationship. I mean, I would talk to him, and I would check in with him. But one of the things I did a lot, and I, maybe it's common for other siblings I kept [00:12:00] tabs on this, on him. Like, I had his location. I'd call him, like, multiple times a day 'cause he wasn't doing anything. It wasn't like he was working. Or, well, he was, but he wasn't. Um, It wasn't like he was in school. So I was basically giving up a lot of my life to... don't even wanna say, like, mother him, but unfortunately, like, my parents had a very different relationship with him. So I, again, I felt like I owed it to him to, like, not abandon him in a way. So I was always, like, keeping tabs on him.
Azlyn: Where's he going? What is he doing? Who's he talking to? It became a lot. Some would say it was a very toxic way of living. But again, like, I owed it to him
Dominique: You're bringing up a lot of different things. One, feeling like, quote, like you owe them or like you're obligated to protect or help them through this situation, but you're also talking about this belief that people are telling you that he needs to hit his rock bottom, and there's also, like, your own need for support and understanding of what's going on.
Dominique: Did you find, like, resources for yourself during that time? Like, how did you navigate or make decisions [00:13:00] around, like, how to support Andrew during that time? And, like, were there any points where you felt like you could go to your parents and, like, talk to them about certain things, or anybody else that you could talk to about certain things?
Azlyn: Unfortunately, no. And I will say that obviously I love my parents. They're very great, and they've done a lot for us, but It's one of those things, I think, where it's like you don't really know what to do or even what to say for that matter, unless you're in it, right? They would say the same thing being an alcoholic, right?
Azlyn: Like, I have no idea what it's like to be where Andrew was. Just as my parents didn't know what it was like to be me, being his younger sister, you know, basically like right there with him, like always, like, they used to call us two peas in a pod, and
Azlyn: that's essentially what we were. We were two peas in a pod.
Azlyn: But they didn't get it. And my brother was living with my grandparents at the time, and I remember so many times, Dominique, begging these people, my aunt, my grandparents, my mom, my dad, even my sister one time, like begging them to get him help.
Dominique: It's interesting 'cause, [00:14:00] like, siblings, especially when you guys are closer in age, you see that person day in and day out. Like, you know them really well. And the sibling relationship and the sibling experience is very different than a parent and child or any other family member or a friend because you see a different side of them at home, but you also see, like, the social side of them
Azlyn: Yeah. Maybe other siblings go through this, and so I was... At this time I was a senior in high school, so I had been dealing with this for three years. So one year was, like, the pandemic, so nothing really happened. But my junior and senior year, hated it in high school because my brother was, like, the talk of the town, for lack of better words.
Azlyn: Like, he do something stupid, and you know how social media is, it gets out on social media very quickly. then it's just like, that's just what the school talks about. So there were so many times where his old teachers, and they didn't mean it, but they'd, realize that, like, I was his sibling and they'd be like, "Oh, how's Andrew?" Or these, like, kids around me were like, "What did Andrew do? How's Andrew?"
Azlyn: I would [00:15:00] cover up for him. Like, "Oh, he's good. He's working, fishing," whatever the case may be. But eventually it did get to a point where I was like, "You know what? Why don't you call him?" I was like, "I haven't talked to him in a very long time.
Azlyn: Like, maybe you could call him 'cause you probably would find out more than I did." And you know, looking back, I don't know that that was my best, move because it was kind of putting him on the spot. But at the same time, like, I kind of realize that I to really stop covering up for him because was...
Azlyn: Nothing good was coming out of it, if that makes sense.
Dominique: Yeah that's actually something that I would suggest someone to do is not covering up for them anymore and allowing them to take ownership and accountability of whatever consequences it might be, how little or big they are.
Dominique: Even if it's just a friend or someone else reaching out to them and asking them, like, "Hey, what's up?" Like, "What's going on?" Because I think it's very different when that person is able to speak to what's going on themselves rather than another person, whether it's a friend or a family member covering up or [00:16:00] saying their version of the story.
Dominique: So I think it, it forces them to take, like, a level of accountability. The question that I have for you is, like, when did you realize that, like, supporting Andrew and loving him wasn't the same as like, controlling or guiding his recovery process?
Azlyn: So to be honest with you one thing I've realized about recovery.
Azlyn: It's a very up and down, journey, right? Like, you think he's doing great, and then it plummets. You think he's doing great, and then it plummets. So he and I, like, like I said, so I graduated in 2022, and one of my deals with him was, like, make it to my graduation, make it to Christmas, make it to Valentine- like, all these, like, little things, and it was, like, my way kind of, like, of encouraging him because I knew, at the time, I knew deep down, like, he could do it. Other people didn't believe in him, I think, as much as I did, which is unfortunate. But I remember in 2023, I came home one day, and again, he wasn't living with us, and my mom said, "He's gonna go to rehab." And I was like, "No, he's not." I was like, "He's just [00:17:00] not going." I was like, "I know how he is. I've been doing this for three years.
Azlyn: Like, he doesn't need help, so why would he go?" And she was like, "No, like, he's gonna go. He's gonna go to California." And I was like, "That's hilarious." Like, "He's not gonna get on a plane and go to California." And she's like, "No, he is." so I called him, and I was like, "Are you really gonna go?" And he was like, "I don't know."
Azlyn: And I was like, "Don't go." Like, because my thing and, you know, like, I know that you and I have talked about it a little bit, but he could go, but then he could just stop going, and now he's across the country. So it's not like he can just walk home, you know? Like, it'd be a little bit more than just stopping going to treatment. So he wound up not going, and remember I was in college at the time, but I had stayed home for some reason one day, and he comes into my room, and he's like, "Azlyn, I'm gonna go to rehab." And I was like, "Andrew, y- we've been talking about this for a week, and, like, you're not gonna go." He's like, "No, but I really am." And I was like, "Dude, no you're not." Like, "Stop wasting my time." And my mom could hear our conversation, and she was like, "No, Azlyn," like, "he's going." Like, "Your grandparents are bringing him [00:18:00] right now." And so I got really upset, and I started, like, crying, and I was like, "Why are you gonna leave me?" Like, "I can't believe you're doing this."
Azlyn: Like, I kinda made it a little bit more about myself and, like, how he was gonna, like, fail me, and how could you do this after everything I've done with you? Whatever.
Dominique: were you saying that he wasn't gonna go to rehab because you had doubted him? Or were you saying he wasn't gonna go to rehab because you couldn't imagine the thought of him not being home with you?
Azlyn: Both. I genuinely did not believe he was going because every time I'd say something to
Dominique: Got it
Azlyn: "I don't have an issue. I don't have an issue. I don't need help. Like, I'm fine. I'm gonna figure it out." And so, you know, once you hear that for so long, it's almost like the boy who cries wolf. Like, I really believe that he was just gonna figure this out.
Dominique: Right
Azlyn: so he went I don't know how it is everywhere, but he was not really able to talk to us. Like, he would get, I wanna say it was, like, 15 minutes a week almost, and but he would always wanna talk to his mom, which was funny to me. Like, looking back, that's hilarious because he and our mom did not [00:19:00] get along for a lot of this, like, chunk of time because of just, like, the way things had gone. And I think, I genuinely think he was embarrassed about what had happened. But I remember one of the times I did talk to him, and it was like something had changed in him, and it was, like, freaky, to be honest with you. Like, he was calm. He could think straight. He knew what he was saying. Like, it was very weird.
Azlyn: And so it actually scared me. I was like, "I can't believe you did this." But at the same time, I felt, like, this overwhelming, like, sense of peace in a way because I didn't have to worry, like, is he gonna make it home safe tonight? Like, is he gonna wind up dead? Because a lot of this time, like, I had this, like, underlying fear that he was gonna wind up dead.
Dominique: It's scary because, like, this idea of him going to rehab or going into treatment is, one, it's like when they admit that they're going to get some kind of help or get treatment, it's an admission of, like, this is a real problem, right? So it makes everything that you're dealing with a little bit more real.
Dominique: And on top of that, [00:20:00] especially if you're siblings, and in this case you guys are obviously very close in a relationship but also close in age, is that who am I without my person being there, without my sibling being there? So it kind of forces you to renavigate, like, understand what your identity is and who you are as a person outside of the context of being, like, the sister who's trying to help her brother
Azlyn: Exactly, yeah. And I always relate it to, like, and again, this is probably not the best way to do it, but if you ever, like, break up a relationship that you were, like, really close with, and you always, like, you always gotta keep tabs on them and all of the sudden you're keeping tabs on somebody who's no longer in your life.
Azlyn: It almost felt like that, because it wasn't like his location was off 'cause his phone was off. So I'd be like, go to check his location knowing full and well it wasn't gonna be on. But it was just like I didn't wanna, like, let that part go. So then he wound up switching rehabs. He went to another place. And that place he was able to have visitors. And so I kept telling my mom, like, "I kinda wanna go see him. I kinda wanna go see him." And she was like, [00:21:00] "I don't know if it's a good idea." Like, "I don't know if he wants you to do that," whatever. So I I wrote him a letter. And like that was my way to, like, be in touch with him, was like, "I'm gonna write you this letter.
Azlyn: What you do with it is your decision, but at least I put in the effort." And that's how I feel with, like, a lot of my life is at least I tried. And so he wrote me a letter back, and I have this letter, and I'm gonna keep it for the rest of my life. But he, like, like I said, something changed in him. He said, I remember I was look- 'cause I was looking at it earlier, he was like, "Aslyn," like, "I feel calmer now."
Azlyn: Like, "I feel different. I'm back on medicine. Like, my life is worth living." And right before he had turned himself in, which we'll get to that in a second, but he wound up turning himself in, he genuinely did not wanna live anymore. Because I think he finally realized he had an issue, but he didn't know how to get help. Because, again, like, he didn't really wanna admit to people that he had an issue. And while he was away, he made me promise, well, he made all of us promise that we weren't gonna say where he was. So people would ask me, like, "How's [00:22:00] Andrew? What's he doing?" And I'm like, "He's doing good." Like, I haven't talked to him very much recently, but he's doing good. Because I had to, like, respect him, and I had to protect him. Like I, I didn't want to ruin our trust, right? 'Cause I had worked so hard on this. And so he was away, and I knew he was away, but I didn't tell anybody. So we went to go see him I remember my mom was like, "Okay, like, we can go see him now, like, right before he comes out." And he was only gone, like, maybe up, over, a little over a month, but it felt like an eternity.
Dominique: Mm-hmm.
Azlyn: I thought he was never coming home. But we went to go see him, and like I said, he was a very different person. Like, he was just so much calmer, and it was like this part of him that I hadn't seen in three years, legitimately. And so I said a couple of things to him. You know, like I said, he had some challenges, and so he was in a really rough situation b- even before this. So this kind of like added onto it. And so I had said a couple things to him, like, "Do not relapse," because essentially, like, it will ruin our [00:23:00] relationship, and I was like, "I don't want that, and you don't want that." And it upset him.
Azlyn: But you know, a little after he came home, he realized. He was like, "Azlyn, you were right. Like, you saying that to me, like, really meant a lot to me." So he came home, and I didn't know how to interact with him. Like, I had never seen this boy so sober.
Azlyn: I didn't know how to interact with him, and so I remember, like, I was working at a hospital at the time, and one of the doctors that I was very close with, and I still am, she is also a recovering addict. And so I had talked to her a little bit, and I was like, "What do I do?" I was like, "'Cause he's living in my house.
Azlyn: Like, he wants to talk to me, but I don't really know how to talk to him." And she was like, "Just be yourself." And I was like, "W- what does that even mean?" I was like, "Be myself?" I was like, "Do you know what I just went through with him?"
Dominique: Mm-hmm. It's tough because, like, you're talking about a lot of different things and, like, going back to what you said, like, when he is in treatment or in the rehab, like, you have this hope about, like, what your relationship could look like. You have this hope about who he is, [00:24:00] and it's all good and well until, like you were saying, like, you reenter that dynamic.
Dominique: He's coming back home, and now you're trying to figure out too, like, what does it actually look like to have a relationship with you when you're sober, when things are pretty, I wanna say, like, normal or they seem, like, okay on the surface. And because for so long, like, you're operating as two siblings that are stuck in your own dynamics, and, like, now that dynamic changes, it forces you to, like, look at things with a microscope and figure out, like, "Okay," like, "is this actually normal?"
Dominique: Like, what does it mean to just, quote, "be yourself" when you probably haven't had a chance to really do that with him in the past?
Azlyn: Yeah. And so, you know, I had like talked to a couple... Once he had come home, like he was fine with people like knowing where he was because he was proud of himself. And because, like I said, in the beginning, he didn't think he needed help. He realized he did, and he made the right decision.
Azlyn: But so I remember like talking to a couple of my friends, and I was like, "Yeah, like, he, you know, he's home. Like, [00:25:00] it's so different." And they said, "Well, he's gonna relapse again." so I had it like burned in my brain, like he was gonna relapse again, right? 'Cause so much of my life, I was like waiting for the other shoe to drop, right?
Azlyn: Like, it was a very cyclical process. He'd be good, then something catastrophic would happen. He'd be good, and then something catastrophic would happen. So I was trying to live this life where I don't wanna say I was like ignoring the fact of him potentially relapsing, but I wanted to focus on the fact that he was sober.
Azlyn: And, you know, he started going to meetings. He started doing service work. He started doing all these things, and he really shaped up his life. And I remember saying to him like, "Wow, Andrew, like I'm really proud of you." And so we rebuilt our relationship. And you know, at his two year... So he made it almost three years sober.
Azlyn: So at his two-year anniversary one thing my family and I always did, because we thought it was important to support him, is on the last Saturday of every month is when he would get his chip. So on the last Saturday of every month, we would go to his AA meeting, and he'd get his [00:26:00] chip, and we'd like go out to dinner, and we'd celebrate, right?
Azlyn: Because we wanted him to know we were proud of him. Because, you know, one thing he shared with me throughout this was that he didn't think family was proud of him. He didn't think his family loved him. And I was like, "But we do." was like, "We've been through a lot with you, but like, we do, and especially now that you're sober, like we are proud of you." And so I had shared that with my parents, and they were like, "Okay." So like that was the decision we made as a family is we did that. So at his two-year anniversary, his sponsor asked me like, "Do you wanna give him his chip?" And I didn't really know much went into this, and I was like, "Yeah, sure. Of course."
Azlyn: Like, whatever. Like, cool. Makes me look great, right? So he shares his story. I'm sitting there with the chip, and his sponsor was like, "Okay," like, "Go give him his chip." So I walk up there, and I'm standing next to him, and I looked at him, and we have nicknames for each other. One of them is I call him Bubba. And I looked at him and I said, "Bubba," I said, "I'm really proud of you." And then I started like crying, and I looked at him and I said, "I didn't think you were gonna make it."
Dominique: [00:27:00] Yeah, it's tough because you're finally being hit with that realization that, like, you made it as far as you did, especially when you have other people or voices in the back of your head saying, "This person's gonna relapse." And
Azlyn: Yeah
Dominique: like, If you're always waiting for that other shoe to drop, when you're finally in a moment where you get to enjoy it, it doesn't feel real or it doesn't always feel like it's long-lasting because things are constantly changing when you have a sibling or a family member that's struggling with addiction.
Dominique: So it's definitely, like, a, like, an amazing experience to have and to feel like you're able to support him and be involved in that process.
Azlyn: Yeah, and so like I said, like, during this time, like, we had an incredible relationship, and I truly, like, there were so many times where I really didn't think he was gonna make it out alive. And so I was even, like, playing in my head, like, "What am I gonna say to my kids in the future when they ask me about their uncle?"
Azlyn: And I'm gonna be like, "Oh, I'm sorry, like, he's dead." And so that, like, scared me a lot. And so when he was sober, I was like, "Wow, there's, like, a chance that, like, can basically mend our relationship."
Azlyn: [00:28:00] Unfortunately, he did not long after that relapse again. And so it kind of... Like, I was older at the time, o- obviously older than I was when it started.
Azlyn: I was maybe, like, 20 years old or something. So it was definitely, like, a different perspective
Dominique: Yeah. It's interesting because it forces you to think about, like, how your relationship is changing and also, like, where you are in your own life, like outside of the context of your brother, and how you're bringing those new experiences, too, into your relationship and into the dynamic. Did you find that there were, like, any boundaries that you created with your brother or boundaries that might have even been hard to set or to maintain during that process between his sobriety and relapse?
Azlyn: No. 'Cause one thing about me is I'm terrible making bounderies
Azlyn: But I did make it very clear to him, you know, when he... So again, like, I basically, and I hate to say it, but, like, I know the ins and outs of this, this boy, right? So, like, I was catching him in, like, situations where I was like, "He's definitely out drinking." Right? Like, he'd be at the bar, and he'd tell me, "Oh, [00:29:00] I'm just listening to music." And I was like, "Okay," like, And I thought he had enough, like, self-control not to drink.
Azlyn: So for a couple months, like, I was oblivious to the fact he was drinking, because he obviously didn't say anything to me, and I didn't wanna call him out on it, because I was like, "I'm not gonna accuse you of something that I have no proof that you're doing." So I kinda like kept it to myself.
Azlyn: But I remember he was in his room, and he heard me in the bathroom, and he was like, "Come in here." And so I did, and he's like, "I wanna tell you something." And I was like, "What do you, like, what do you wanna tell me today?" And he was like, "I relapsed." And I was like, "You did what?" And he was like, "Yeah, I started drinking, like, two months ago."
Azlyn: And so, you know, it, it destroyed me, because not that I I kind of knew it, but for him to admit it to me, like, that was just, like, a whole new level. It was like, wow, like, it's really true. Like, you thought this whole time is true. so I kind of just said to him, like, "You know, that's really unfortunate, and I still love you, but you need to make proper choices," I said, "because I'm not doing this with you [00:30:00] again
Dominique: First of all, it's kind of amazing that your brother came to you and admitted that to you because it shows you that he feels obviously that connection, but also he feels a level of safety with you to come forward and share that. But when you said, "I'm not doing this again," like what did you mean by that?
Azlyn: I wasn't gonna continue to, like, essentially bail him out, right? Like, I was gonna...
Dominique: Mm-hmm.
Azlyn: This time, he was gonna have to face all these consequences of his actions. Because I have always felt like he got handouts in, with this whole thing. Like, like I said, he's been in some very, like, rough situations that could have gone a
Dominique: Right
Azlyn: way, and he got very lucky and it didn't. But,
Dominique: Right
Azlyn: you know, at this point, I was like, "Okay, like, I can't keep killing myself essentially to save your life. Like, you're gonna have to
Dominique: Right
Azlyn: man up in a way. Like, you're 20-something years old. Like, you're gonna face these consequences, and it's gonna suck, and I'm sorry, but, like, essentially this is a choice you made
Dominique: Yeah. A lot of people will say, like, sometimes relapse is part of the recovery process because especially if the person is younger, they don't have, like, the [00:31:00] skill set. it puts them in a lot of vulnerable positions to make new changes, which can be really hard. Were there any changes that you've made in this process once your brother was, like, right after he relapsed, is, w- was there anything you did differently then than you might have not have done previously?
Azlyn: So I would say like a couple of times I was like making excuses for his actions, right? Like, oh, he wanted to fit in. Oh, he didn't know how to have friends, and like his friends that he met were like drinkers. And so, but this time, like I kind of, I don't know, it's like a much different, like much different situation obviously, and I kind of was just like, all right, like if this is what he's gonna do, like this is what he's gonna do.
Azlyn: One thing that didn't change is like the fear. And it was like traumatizing. It was like I had to live in fear again because you never know what he's gonna do. Like, he's very unpredictable in a way, and so I was like, "Okay, is he gonna make it home alive tonight?" Like, but I was batch checking his location, and he'd be like at the bar at 3:00 in the morning.
Azlyn: I finally convinced him one day to speak [00:32:00] to a therapist, and he spoke to him one time and he was like, "This isn't it." And so I would always just tell him like, "You know, these are decisions you're making." "I can't change them for you." And I'm like, "I love you, but you need to change."
Azlyn: And so he did in a way. He relapsed, he got sober, he relapsed, he got sober. Like it was like this whole thing. But he was doing it, he admitted he was doing it for other people. He was never really doing it for himself because that was his way to like keep people in his life.
Azlyn: And I looked at him and I said, "Well," said like, "That's great and all, but you gotta do it for yourself." And so a couple months ago he called me, and he was like, "I screwed up again." And I was like, "What do you mean you screwed up?" And so he had gotten drunk and he made some very poor decisions, and that's when I said to him, 'cause I had reached my breaking point, I said, "Well," I said, "you need to figure this out before I figure it out for you."
Dominique: And what does that mean? That you're gonna figure it out for him?
Azlyn: you know, I didn't really know what it meant, but essentially it meant, like, to me it was like, "I'm not gonna have a relationship with you at all. Like, I'm gonna cut you off cold [00:33:00] turkey." And it was kind of like my... I don't wanna say it was a scare tactic, but it was, like, kind of my way to, like, make him check himself.
Azlyn: Like, knew. I, 'cause I had kept telling him like, "I'm not doing this with you again. Like, we're not gonna have a relationship if you're gonna continue to make these decisions."
Dominique: Yeah.
Azlyn: Yeah,
Dominique: It's tough because, like, it sounds like you guys are both making choices or decisions based on how the other person might feel or what you might want for the other person. Like, he's probably going to rehab or treatment because that's what you or your parents or his other people in his life are telling him to do, and then you also are concerned.
Dominique: And at the end of the day, it's like you guys both have to make those decisions, whether it's creating boundaries or getting treatment for yourselves, right?
Azlyn: Yeah
Dominique: that's what's really challenging is that when you're in this dynamic with your sibling or even if it's another family member that you're very close with, it's tough because you care so much about them that you often put, like, their needs ahead of your own because that's just what you know how to do, right?
Azlyn: Yeah. Yeah. And so, you [00:34:00] know, I will say, and I'm very proud of him, but he's now been sober actually for, since the end of May. And he admitted it to me, you know? Like, we, we had, like, conversations here and there about it,
Azlyn: he was like, "You know what? I'm finally gonna do it for myself, because I, I owe it to myself." He's like, "I'm gonna do it for myself because I..." He's like, "I've seen how my life can be when I'm sober." And I was like,
Azlyn: "Exactly, Andrew. And I don't wanna, like, make it sound bad, but, like, he had an incredible life when he was sober. He built back his trust with my parents. You know, he moved back into my
Dominique: Right
Azlyn: He had incredible relationships. He had incredible things, right? and he knows that. And I think it just took him a little bit to, like, finally realize that. But you know, like, even today, like, even to this day, right, like, our relationship now, you know, whenever I talk to him, I s- always end it with, "I love you.
Azlyn: Make good choices." And that's when I,
Dominique: I love that
Azlyn: his court. Like, take that and make it mean what you want, but he knows what it means to me. It means, like, you're not gonna make choices that you're gonna regret
Dominique: Yeah, I love that because one, you're just kind of [00:35:00] sharing this mantra and this reminder with him without having to re-divulge and say the same thing over and over. So you're still maintaining, like, this presence in his life. And the interesting thing about, like, recovery too, and sometimes even, like, intermittent periods of recovery or sobriety mixed with relapse, is that when you do have those periods of sobriety, it serves as that reminder as to what your life could look like, what your relationships could look like if you do relapse, right?
Dominique: Like, I've shared with you my brother's been sober now about a year and a half or so, and he's rebuilding his life, and he's regaining that taste of sobriety and understanding what his life could look like, what his relationships could look like,
Azlyn: Yeah
Dominique: Yeah ... the types of support. So, you know, knowing that relapse is a very common part of the recovery process, knowing that information is always gonna be available to him, it's gonna create an experience for us.
Dominique: So there's a lot of learning that goes on during recovery and also during relapse for the person who's using, [00:36:00] but also for the family members involved, too.
Azlyn: Yeah.
Dominique: I wanna ask you, like, now that your brother, it sounds like he is sober at this period, like, what does your relationship look like today? And, like, how do you hope it evolves in the future?
Azlyn: Yeah, so I mean, right now, like, we have a good relationship, I would say. You know, as life goes, you go through these, like ups and downs. And so like I've been going through these like ups and downs recently, and I've... You know, like I always, I don't know if we wanna say, like we confide in each other, but like I'll talk to him about
Dominique: Mm-hmm.
Azlyn: and you know, now that he's sober, he has a much like, clear answer for me.
Azlyn: Whereas like before when I would like go through things and he was like, not sober, he'd be like, "Azem, like you're just being dramatic," or just like, "Ah, what do you want me to do?" Whereas now he's like, "Azem, like, yes, it sucks, but like you need to make a decision about this. Like this is in... The ball's in your court."
Azlyn: Which is like funny 'cause I'd always say the same thing to him. But I just feel like, you know, now he's like, he's more mature, I guess.
Azlyn: I don't know. Like he [00:37:00] sees how his life can be when he's sober, and so I really hope that he leans into that. And it's given me hope truly. Like, like I said, when he first came home, like I had so much hope for our future, right?
Azlyn: After so many years of like heartbreak and disappointment and fear and all of this, like I finally felt like I could live again.
Dominique: Right
Azlyn: slowly getting back to that. Again, like now he's 24, he just turned 24, and so I always say to him like, "You know what? You're an adult. You make your own decisions, but you just have to think about the long-term consequences of decisions, whether that's good or bad
Dominique: Yeah, absolutely. There's no linear path to recovery. Like, everyone's journey is gonna look a little bit different, including for the family members. So I think that's super important. I wanna begin closing out with asking you two different questions. One, what do you wish more people understood about being the sibling of someone who's struggling with addiction or substance use?
Dominique: And what would you tell another young sibling who's just beginning this journey?
Azlyn: Yeah, so, it's very [00:38:00] funny that I'm here today because I never thought this would be me. A, I never thought I would deal with something like this in my life. B, I never thought I would talk about it, because for so much of my life, like I said earlier, like I don't talk very much about my life, and I try to like protect, you know, like the people in my life, right?
Azlyn: But you know, I will say like, and I talked about it earlier, but when we were, when I first started going through this, like it was scary, and I didn't know what to do because there wasn't like... It's not like I was 25 years old, and you know, I had lived more life and I knew how to like cope with all these things 'cause I didn't. And so you know, if I was to say something to somebody now it would be never lose hope, right? Like I lost hope so many times, and it's very easy to lose hope, don't get me wrong. But you never know how your life can evolve, if that makes sense. So like it took one day of him going
Dominique: Mm-hmm.
Azlyn: and he got sober, and it gave me like this new sense of hope. So definitely also [00:39:00] find people you can trust. My guidance counselor was truly like my rock through it all because like I said, like I didn't really talk about it with my parents, I didn't talk about it with friends 'cause I was protecting him. But I talked about it a lot with my guidance counselor, and she would always say the same thing to me.
Azlyn: She'd say, "Azlyn, likeyou deserve to be happy and you deserve to live a life that you want." And for so much of my life I felt like I've... and I still do sometimes, I feel like I'm living for other people. But you have to find the things that make you happy, and as cliche as that sounds, like know, there are people out there that understand what you're going through.
Azlyn: And that's my whole hope with sharing this today, right? It's like if I had heard this or I had known somebody who had been through this when I was younger, I would have felt so much less alone
Dominique: Yeah, it's tough because, like, siblings, there's not a lot of resources for siblings who have a brother or sister struggling with addiction. And addiction is already this topic that is so [00:40:00] stigmatized, especially when you're a teenager. You don't really know a lot about addiction, or especially if you don't really have a family member who struggles with addiction.
Dominique: It's har- it's hard to know how to support someone who's dealing with that.
Azlyn: I had talked to one person, you know, that had been through this himself as an addict, and I was, like, telling him, like, what was going on. And, you know, one thing he said to me that has stuck with me, you know, for this long, and it always will, was he said, "You have to believe that your brother is still there." I said, "Well, what do you mean?" And he said, "Well, deep down it's still your brother," he said, "but this disease is masking it." And so when he said that to me, you know, like, it took me a minute, and I was like, "You know what? You're right." Like, Andrew is still Andrew. It's just he's got this-- 'cause addiction's a disease, and so he's got this disease that's, like, masking it, right?
Azlyn: And so I would say, like, obviously, like, within your own, it's your own decision, but try not to, like, cut them off. Try not... Like I said, don't give up hope because I feel like if you give up hope, you give up so much of your life, right? Like, like I said, I've always had hope for
Dominique: Yeah
Azlyn: and yeah, there were times I didn't think he was gonna make it out [00:41:00] alive. But nothing is more I will say, as a sibling, than seeing him come out on the other side
Dominique: Yeah, I totally agree with that. Like, I think, you know, how a sibling is gonna support their brother or sister through this process is gonna be very different. But I think there's, depending on what the relationship is like, I think there's power in maintaining a relationship with healthy boundaries.
Dominique: 'Cause that way you're prioritizing yourself, but you still learn how to be there for your brother or sister. So I love this idea of, like, not cutting them off. And in some situations, like, some family members are gonna have to do that depending on what their dynamic is like. But I think to the extent where you can maintain a relationship with boundaries, I think is really important.
Dominique: So I love that you're talking about that. And then also, you know, as your relationship, as they get older and as your relationship with them evolves, there's gonna be new opportunities for siblings to reconnect in a way that works for their dynamic, right? I'm sure you're gonna learn a lot about yourself and learn a lot about your relationship with Andrew as you guys get older and he gets further into his recovery process.[00:42:00]
Dominique: So I love that you shared that.
Azlyn: you know, like that's always like a thing that I've always thought about, right? Like, you know, with what I've seen with Andrew, like I don't drink. And for a while, like I just, I don't know, like I didn't think... I thought it was like fine, right? Like, and I, what I mean by that is like not everybody needs to drink, obviously. But you know, he always said to me like, "Don't let my decisions direct your life." And I was like, "You're right." But there's also like it's okay. It's okay to be scared to drink, okay? 'Cause for so much of my life, I was like, I c- how am I gonna like be an adult if I don't drink? I'm gonna tell you, mocktails are a great thing.
Azlyn: Again, it's like your own personal decision, right? Like, there are so many things in your life that shape how you are, and this has shaped how I am, right? Like, I've seen these things can go, and it scares me. but that's okay
Dominique: Yeah, absolutely. Like that's something I would encourage all of our listeners to keep in mind. It's easier to make decisions when you live by whatever your personal values [00:43:00] are. Because when you know what your values are and what's important, it's easier to create boundaries, it's easier to make decisions that aren't rooted in guilt or shame or being embarrassed.
Dominique: So I love that you're talking about that because everyone's personal decisions and values are gonna be so different
Azlyn: Yeah, right? Like , this situation like the way I look at people who drink? Absolutely, yes. And one thing I want to say is like not everybody is an alcoholic, right? Like, I know many people in my life who can consume alcohol and then it up,
Dominique: Absolutely
Azlyn: better words, right?
Azlyn: Like, not everybody... Like, there was like this period of time where I was like, "Everybody's an alcoholic," right? Like, I mean, how can you not be? But I had to make the decision myself, right? Like, I have drank in the past, and I don't like the way it makes me feel. So want it to become like a thing where I could like one-up him in a way and be like, "Look what I can do that you can't." And one thing I will say too is like you need to find like your outlets, because Andrew and I do not talk very much about his addiction. But I obviously do talk about it in certain situations, and [00:44:00] that's okay because, you know, when you go through
Dominique: Mhm.
Azlyn: definitely changes you, and it give, it definitely gives you like a new outlook on life
Dominique: Yeah, absolutely. And I think as much as someone can learn about, like, the science of addiction and, like, what makes someone more prone to alcohol use or substance use versus another person, I think definitely helps siblings or other family members, like, have more compassion because it's not, like you said, it's not something that's gonna affect everyone.
Dominique: But understanding why it affects a certain person is super helpful. So with that being said, Az, I wanna thank you so much for coming onto the show today, sharing your personal story, how you and your brother are navigating your relationship, and also the hope that you're providing for other siblings, especially the ones that are younger who might still be navigating this or dealing with this for the first time.
Azlyn: One thing I will say is like, there's like these times where I think about everything we've been through, and I still have like some fear in a way. I go to therapy. And this is one of the things I talk about. And you just kinda have to learn to like deal with it in a way that is healthy for you, [00:45:00] but never lose hope.
Dominique: Thanks for listening to this episode of For Love of Recovery. If you enjoyed this episode or know somebody who might, please leave a comment and share it. You can also join our Facebook group, Siblings For Love of Recovery. If you're looking to have deeper conversations around your siblings drug or alcohol addiction. And remember whether there's hope, there's healing.